Author Topic: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values  (Read 15879 times)

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2010, 08:26:05 PM »
Why are religious values necessary to be a good human being? Because the glorious Qur'an is the only book undistorted ever. It's declared by the non-muslim harsh critics of Islam. The concept of Humanism changes over the time across the countries and places. I have found many people who speak for ethics are after money. I have seen people who speak for LOVE are miser and hardly donate money to the poor. The Qur'an says if you save more than 30000 taka in a year, you have to donate 2.5% to the poor. It's compulsory.

Please don't look at the followers; Islam cannot be judged by looking at the followers. The followers are responsible if they don't follow the Qur'an. But the so-called atheism or humanism has got no unchangeable instruction manuals that often vary from person to person. In the UK, having a baby without marriage is nothing about unethical. Who knows someday will come when they will say marrying own brother or sister is ethical? 
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #16 on: June 12, 2010, 03:21:55 PM »
Dear Sameen sir

We, the human beings, want reward and recognition in every case. If you are sure that you are NOT going to get any reward and recognition from the organization you work, how long will you work there?  But DIU recognized your efforts and rewarded you with the position of Senior Lecturer.

Reward and recognition are there in the mind of every human being. Even you can get things done by a child with the motivation of reward. But if Allah wants to grant us reward n recognition; we, human beings are not happy with His system. Allah said, surely we, human beings are ungrateful. We hardly recognize and appreciate the bounties and facilities we get every single second from HIM. 

As a matter of fact, the concept of ethics is useless without the concept of HEREAFTER. Degeneration will occur if there is no belief in GOD.
« Last Edit: June 12, 2010, 03:49:21 PM by shibli »
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline Mustafizur rRhman

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2010, 04:53:30 PM »
Dont misunderstand me sir, I m not an atheist, I m a believer. I also do believe that Islam makes poeple better human beings. I only wanted to get more information from u my dear sir nothing else.

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #18 on: June 13, 2010, 04:54:10 PM »
Crude Understanding of Disbelief

The foremost and inherent characteristic of the members of an ignorant society is their unwillingness to develop a consciousness of God. Thus, people in this state of ignorance simply avoid complying with the commandments of God, having developed their own moral principles and a way of thinking contrary to everything approved of as being right by the Qur'an. The Qur'an, the last Divine Book, provides all the answers to all possible questions the individual might raise throughout his life. It offers all the key explanations and solutions which he needs in every aspect of his life.

People in this state of ignorance establish a system and then face difficulty in complying with the rules of the system they have themselves created. This is the direct outcome of a crude understanding. However, rather than eradicating this fundamental mistake, ignorant people struggle to find ways of being successful in this relentless competition.

Contrary to the ignorant society's criteria laid down for superiority — in other words property, power and status — the real superiority calls for faith in God and fear of God. The colour of one's skin, good-looks or prosperity have no importance in the presence of God. One day, everyone, be he poor or wealthy, beautiful or ugly, will be wrapped in a simple shroud and placed in a pit — which will reduce his body into insignificance.

What we refer to as "moral values" are the concepts introduced by religion that make life beautiful and rewarding. Whenever these values are distorted, we face a really disturbing picture in society.

First of all, in an environment where no rules and limits are observed, "lawlessness" prevails. In this system, everyone lays down his own rules and principles, based on highly variable criteria. In the ignorant society the basic principle that is applied is not to go to extremes in social conduct and hence not to incur any reaction from the society. It is wholly acceptable to do anything wrong, as long as it is not publicly disclosed. Ignorant people deliver speeches about virtuous conduct and morals, or severely condemn those who hold a contrary view. However, they themselves violate these values when they are convinced that nobody sees them.

Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Rich Countries involved in corruption abroad
« Reply #19 on: July 03, 2010, 04:42:54 PM »

When asking why poor countries are poor, it is quite common to hear, especially in wealthier countries that are perceived to have minimal corruption (at least domestically) that other countries are poor because of corruption. Yet, corruption is not something limited to third world despots. Rich countries too have been involved in corrupt practices around the world.

As Professor Robert Neild from Trinity College, Cambridge University writes in Public Corruption; The Dark Side of Social Evolution (London: Anthem Press, 2002), “Rich countries and their agencies … commonly have been and are accomplices in corruption abroad, encouraging it by their actions rather than impeding it….” (p.209). Specific problems he highlights include:

    * The impact of Cold War corruption (supporting dictatorships, destabilizing democracies, funding opposition, etc);
   
* Firms from rich countries bribing rulers and officials from developing countries to gain export contracts, particularly in the arms trade and in construction (even justifying it by suggesting bribery is “customary” in those countries, so they need to do it to, in order to compete);
   
 * The “corruption-inducing effects of the purchase, by the rich countries and their international corporations, of concessions in Third World countries to exploit natural deposits of oil, copper, gold, diamonds and the like.” Payments made to rulers often violate local (and Western) rules, keeping corrupt rulers in power, who also embezzle a lot of money away.
   
 * The drug trade. Neild suggests that international law and national laws in rich countries that prohibit drugs may serve to “produce a scarcity value irresistible to producers, smugglers and dealers.” Governments and civil society in the third world are often “undermined, sometimes destroyed” by the violence and corruption that goes with the drug trade. “This is probably the most important way in which the policies of rich countries foster corruption and violence. Yet the effect on the Third World seems scarcely to enter discussion of alternative drug policies in the rich countries.” Legalizing drugs, a system of taxation and regulation, comparable to that applied to tobacco and alcohol might do more to reduce corruption in the world than any other measure rich countries could take, he suggests. (See this site’s section on illicit drugs for more on that aspect.)

Rich countries have been used to it, too:

 

Bribery may be pervasive, but it is difficult to detect. Many Western companies do not dirty their own hands, but instead pay local agents, who get a 10 per cent or so “success fee” if a contract goes through and who have access to the necessary “slush funds” to ensure that it does. Bribery is also increasingly subtle.… Until recently, bribery was seen as a normal business practice. Many countries including France, Germany and the UK treated bribes as legitimate business expenses which could be claimed for tax deduction purposes.

— Dr Susan Hawley, Exporting Corruption; Privatisation, Multinationals and Bribery, The Corner House, June 2000
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Corruption everywhere; rich and poor countries, international institutions

It goes without saying, almost, that corruption is everywhere. Corruption in poor countries is well commented on (sometimes used dismissively to explain away problems caused by other issues, too). It would be futile to provide examples here (see also the sources of information at the end of this document for more on this).

Rich countries, also suffer from corruption. Examples are also numerous and beyond the scope of this page to list them here. However, a few recent examples are worth mentioning because they are varied on the type of corruption involved, and are very recent, implying this is a massive problem in rich countries as well as poor.

The first example is the US government, accused of outsourcing many contracts without an open bid process. Jim Hightower notes that “An analysis by the Times found that more than half of their outsourcing contracts are not open to competition. In essence, the Bushites choose the company and award the money without getting other bids. Prior to Bush, only 21% of federal contracts were awarded on a no-bid basis.”

Another example is Italy, where former Italian Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi and some of his close associates were held on trial for various crimes and corruption cases (though Berlusconi himself has not, to date, been found guilty of any charges). Many key teams in the massive Italian soccer league, Serie A were also found to be involved in a massive corruption ring.

In the United Kingdom, the arms manufacturer, BAE was being investigated for bribing Saudi officials to buy fighter planes, but the government intervened in the investigation citing national interests. The Guardian also reported that BAE gave a Saudi prince a £75 airliner ($150m approx) as part of a British arms deal, with the arms firm paying the expenses of flying it. This seemingly large figure is small compared to the overall deal, but very enticing for the deal makers, and it is easy to see how corruption is so possible when large sums are involved.

International institutions, such as the United Nations and World Bank have also recently come under criticism for corruption, ironically while presenting themselves in the forefront fighting against corruption.

The recent example with the UN has been the oil for food scandal, where the headlines were about the corruption in the UN. In reality, the figures of $21 billion or so of illicit funds blamed on the UN were exaggerations; it was $2 billion; it was the UN Security Council (primarily US and UK) responsible for much of the monitoring; US kickbacks for corrupt oil sales were higher, for example. (This is discussed in more detail on this site’s Iraq sanctions, oil for food scandal section.)

At the World Bank, headlines were made when its recent president, Paul Wolfowitz, was forced to resign after it was revealed he had moved his girlfriend to a new government post with an extremely high salary without review by its ethics committee.

Paul Wolfowitz’s appointment was also controversial, due to his influential role in architecting the US invasion of Iraq. A former member of staff at the World Bank also noted concerns of cronyism related to Wolfowitz’s appointment way before the scandal that forced him to resign.

The US nominee for the next president is the former US Trade Representative and currently an executive at Goldman Sachs, Robert Zoellick. His nomination is also coming under criticism. Bush supports it, saying Zoellick “is the right man to succeed Paul in this vital work.” Former World Bank chief economist, and Nobel Prize winner for economics, Joseph Stiglitz feels that instead of a political appointee, it would be better to get an economist who understands development.

As also reported by the BBC, Paul Zeitz, executive director of the Global AIDS Alliance, said that he thought Mr Zoellick was a terrible choice because “Zoellick has no significant experience in economic development in poor countries,” and that “he has been a close friend to the brand-name pharmaceutical industry, and the bilateral trade agreements he has negotiated [for the US] effectively block access to generic medication for millions of people.”

While the US typically gets its preferred nomination to head the World Bank, Europe has typically got its preferred person to head the IMF. Critics have long argued that this lacks transparency and is not democratic. While not illegal as such, it does feel like a form of corruption.
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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The man is poor but honest
« Reply #21 on: July 10, 2010, 06:07:11 PM »
The man is poor but honest

Md. Main Uddin

WHEN I was s student of class seven, I was taught the above-noted English translation. Everything went well regarding this translation until I started reading different books on welfare economics and philosophy. As time passed by, I came to realize that the concept of this translation is wrong as well as misleading. When one says 'the man is poor but honest', it indicates that most of the poor people are dishonest and the very person to whom this translation is applicable is honest while he should be dishonest. This is misleading in the sense that those who learn this concept from the very beginning of their life would have a negative concept about the poor.

Money is one of the most sensitive and important variables that can be used to test honesty of the people. Banks are the principal financial institutions that deal with money and drawing examples from them the issue of honesty and poverty may be resolved. Loan default is a common term known to many of Bangladesh. There is a huge amount of defaulted loans in the banking sector of Bangladesh and most of the defaulters are the borrowers of large loans. The rich take large loans and defaulted ones come mainly from such loans. If there is any bad name arising out of this behaviour of large borrowers, they are almost exclusively liable to that. Thus, it is the rich people who take money from banks and do not give it back. They are also responsible for introducing the culture of loan default in the banking sector of Bangladesh. To make the situation worst, some took loans from the nationalized banks and established private banks by such loans without repaying them. The high default rate has originated from the non-repayment of loans by the rich.

On the other hand, the poor have access to small loans mostly provided by the microfinance institutions (MFIs). Their loan recovery rate is very high. The Grameen Bank, for instance, has the recovery rate of more than 90 per cent. The poor borrowers of these MFIs have proved that banks can bank with them and they always pay back. They also introduced Bangladesh positively to the rest of the world by their disciplined behavior.

Therefore, it can be uncritically generalized that the rich people are the principal loan defaulters and they do not care about the rules and regulations as they know the loopholes of them or they know how to break them. But the poor never think of braking the rules and regulations like the rich do. In the other areas of activities where corruption, irregularities, and indiscipline are pervasive, such generalization in favour of the poor that they are not dishonest is also applicable. Thus, the poor are dishonest, is an outright fallacy as the above arguments prove. Thus, let us stop saying 'the man is poor but honest' and start saying 'the man is poor but dishonest' or 'the man is rich but honest'.

(The writer, an Assistant Professor, Department of Banking, Dhaka University, is currently doing PhD on Microfinance at Tohoku University, Sendai, Japan)

Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline S. HOSSAIN

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #22 on: August 24, 2010, 03:12:57 PM »
every 1 has a personal ethical point of view . but the question is " Is his/ her ethics  follow religious values?"  for example . now a days it is very common that two separate religious  man & woman married. they think their ethics is right. sometime they r very happy  about their life. Is it right according to religious point of view?

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #23 on: September 05, 2010, 04:52:31 PM »
DEBATE ATHEIST [Professor] -V- BELIEVER [Student ]

[Professor ] Are you Muslim,believe in God who is good pouwerful & can do anything. and If here a sick person and you can cure him. Will you try to do it?

[Student]Yes, I would or I would try at least

[Professor ] Yes you are right, everyone will do if they could. But God doesn‘t

[Student:] No answer /silent

[Professor ]Satan and evil is bad but God made them,the evil's, Sickness, Immorality, Hatred, exist everywhere, and which  God created all evil, didn't He, son? "how is it that, this God is good if He created all evil ?

[Student] No answer/silent

[Professor] Science identify five senses like ,See ,Hear, Feel , Taste, Smell. Have you ever seen, heard, felt ,smelt, or tasted your God?

[Student] No answer/silent

[Professor] According to the rules of empirical, testable, demonstrable
protocol, science says your God doesn't exist. Can you prove Where is
your God now?"

[Student] NO SIR, but I've got a question for you sir ...."Is there such a thing as cold?"

[Professor] Yes, son, there's cold too

[Student] You're wrong sir’’ because we can have extra heat, super-heat, mega-heat, white heat, a little heat or no heat. But we don't have anything called 'cold'. We can hit 458 degrees below zero, which is no heat, but we can't go any further after that. There is no such thing as cold, otherwise we would be able to go colder than 458 - - You see, sir, cold is only a word we use to describe the absence of heat. We cannot measure cold. Heat we can measure in thermal units because heat is energy. Cold is not the opposite of heat, sir, just the absence of it."

[Professor]No answer/Silent

[Student] Is there such a thing as darkness, Professor?"

[Professor] Yes (That's a dumb question, What is night if it isn't darkness)

[Student]You're wrong again, sir. Darkness is not something, it is the absence of something. You can have low light, normal light, bright light, flashing light but if you have no light constantly you have nothing  and it's called darkness, isn't it? That's the meaning we use to  define the word. In reality, darkness isn't. If it were, you would  be able to make darkness darker and we can give a jar of it. Can you...give me a jar of darker darkness, professor?"

[Professor:] OK what is your point, young man?"

[Student]Yes, sir. My point is, your philosophical premise is flawed
to start with and so your conclusion must be in error...."

[Professor] How dare you...!""

[Student]"Sir, may I explain, For example there is life and then there's death; a good God and a bad God. You are viewing the concept of God as something finite, something we can measure. Sir, science cannot even explain a thought.
It uses electricity and magnetism but has never seen, much less fully understand them. To view death as the opposite of life is to be ignorant of the fact that death cannot exist as a substantive thing. Death is not the opposite of life, merely the absence of it." Is there such a thing as immorality?"

[Professor] Of course there is,

[Student] "Wrong again, sir. You see, immorality is merely the absence of morality. Is there such thing as injustice? No. Injustice is the absence of justice. Is there such a thing as evil?" Isn't evil the absence of good?" "If there is evil in the world, professor, and we all agree there is, then God, if he exists, must be accomplishing a work through the agency of evil. What is that work God is accomplishing? Islam which means Submission to the will of God , tells us it is to see if each one of us will, choose good over evil."

[Professor ]"As a philosophical scientist, I don't vie this matter as having anything to do with any choice; as a realist, I absolutely do not recognize the concept of God or any other theological factor as being part of the world equation because God is not observable."

[Student] "I would have thought that the absence of God's moral code in this world is probably one of the most observable phenomena going," Tell me, professor. Do you teach your students that, they evolved from a monkey?"

[Professor] Yes of course "If you are referring to natural evolutionary process,

[Student ]"Have you ever observed evolution with your own eyes, sir?" "Professor. Since no-one has ever observed the process of evolution at work and cannot even prove that this process is an on-going endeavour, are you not teaching your opinion, sir? Are you now not a scientist, but a priest?"

[Professor ] I will overlook your impudence in the light of philosophical debate."

[Student ]""So you don't accept God's moral code to do ... what is righteous?"

[Professor ]I believe in what is - that's science!"

[Student ] SCIENCE!" "Sir, you rightly state that science is the study of observed phenomena. Science too is a premise which is flawed..." However about your early point may I give you an example."have you ever seen air, Oxygen, molecules, atoms, or your own brain, have you ever heard your brain felt your brain, touched or smelt your brain?"

[Professor]No answer/silent

[Student ]  Sir, It appears you never had any sensory perception of the your own brain whatsoever. Therefore according to the rules of empirical, stable, demonstrable protocol, science, I am sorry to DECLARE that YOU HAVE NO BRAIN’’ Sir
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #24 on: September 18, 2010, 11:08:04 AM »
Is it ethical to flatter your boss to get sometime done????
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #25 on: September 23, 2010, 03:16:09 PM »
There is a direct relation between ethics and money. Our chairperson sir once said to me, if a person is always after money, his or her ethics is zero percent. I agree with him. If i think i will always get something done with money, my ethics is zero.
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline mamun

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #26 on: September 26, 2010, 10:37:32 AM »
Very much true speech by Honorable Chairman Sir. Our ethics will be ruined if we only go after the money. I believe one thing:
“Just search works and done it properly, money will be come eventually/gradually”.  
Professor Rafiqul Islam
Dean, FBE

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #27 on: September 27, 2010, 09:43:28 AM »
Our everyday activities represent our personality and character.
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline shibli

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #28 on: September 28, 2010, 10:21:05 AM »
Is it ethical Not to pay any taxes to the Govt. or not to submit any income tax return ever for someone who  is working professionally for the last 15 years.....or more?
Those who worship the natural elements enter darkness (Air, Water, Fire, etc.). Those who worship sambhuti sink deeper in darkness. [Yajurveda 40:9]; Sambhuti means created things, for example table, chair, idol, etc.

Offline bidita

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Re: The concept of ethics is useless without religious values
« Reply #29 on: September 28, 2010, 10:42:41 AM »
yes, sir....paying taxes is highly ethical....he who doesn't pay tax is an unethical person...., according to me..
Bidita Rahman :)
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